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Sciatic Pain

PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2007 8:01 am
by Michael Jen
Sciatic pain in the glutes and down the leg is a common symptom of those who have problems with their low back. Prior to doing posture alignment therapy, I suffered from it for 12 years.

Sciatic pain cannot be eliminated by simply stretching your hamstrings and glutes. When I was diagnosed with a bulging disc and sent to physical therapy, they gave me hamstring stretches, glute stretches, and ab exercises. It didn't help one single bit. Stretching does not balance out the muscular imbalances that causes this problem. In addition, there are plenty of people who are extremely flexible in their hamstrings and glutes, yet they still suffer from sciatic pain and low back problems.

Those who suffer from this discomfort have probably gone to a doctor, had an MRI taken of their low back, and been told they have some sort of bulging disc. When I was diagnosed with a bulging disc, I was told that the sciatic pain was the disc pushing against a nerve.

Well, the truth is that sciatic pain is not the disc pushing against the nerve. The sciatic pain is the result of the muscles around the nerve tightening up and applying pressure on the nerve. MBF is extremely effective in dealing with sciatic pain due to the fact that when the muscles in the pelvis are stabilized and balanced, the muscles around the nerve relax and return to normal, and the pain is eliminated.

Re: Sciatic Pain

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 9:05 am
by Dan Monahan
Hi Michael

I am from the UK, and I have a Bulging disc at L4-L5. I am only 23 years old, and it all started about 3 1/2 years ago, I studided Martial Arts from the ages of 6, and when I was around 18, I injured my left hip flexor which meant I couldn't lift/flex my hip and kick. Well what do I do, I decided to just kick on my right leg only, Sifu said this is okay as well, and for 2 years I was able to kick and know problems, every now and then I would try and kick on my left and the pain would be too much at the front of the hip.

Then one day.....BANG.....The back of my left hip started to hurt like crazy, when I got up out my chair in work, since then the pain has got worse, I have seen Osteos, Physios, Chiro's, tried accupuncture, Lose the back pain system, Trigger point therapy, started work with a CHEK guy but stretching just made things worse, and also work with a Neuromuscular Therapist trained in the Paul St.John method.

Still nothing has worked, this day, I get pain in many different places, my left QL fatigues really quickly, and I now have a side shift/scoliosis, but it is functional if I bend over the curve dissapears, I get pain down the front of my left leg, pain in left glute, and sometimes numbness down my left leg right to the foot.

Basically I'm a state, I have read Pete Egoscue's books, and they are fantastic, but very hard to follow from the book, but I have just recently found an Egoscue and MBF Therapist in Surrey England :D

He is currently in India and will be back next week, his a 2hr drive from where I live but that doesn't bother me, I'm willing to drive that far, just hope he can make a diffrence.

What I want to know Michael, have you dealt with people with Side Shifts, as in my hips have shifted to the left and my upper body is leaning to the right, because I have a postural protrusion and lateally to the left, so the body has shifted me away from the disc.

Have you dealt with this before and is it possible to correct?

Oh yeah the Therapist I found is called Matt Waters, have you heard of him? I've spoken to him on the phone and he sounds like a great guy

Many thanks
Dan :)

P.S - I'm due to visit a Neurosurgen in the next coming weeks, but I do not want to have surgery, just the pain is too painful, I can't walk far, sitting and driving is fine, but walking and standing is extremely painful!! I can't carry on like this!

Re: Sciatic Pain

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 5:09 pm
by Michael Jen
Matt is solely an Egoscue practitioner. Though he has taken some MBF courses, he is not an MBF practitioner.

Yes, I have experience with the postural deviatation you mentioned and it can be fixed.

You don't need surgery unless you have a complete disc rupture. If you have a protrusion/bulge (and not a rutpure), MBF can deal with that.

Re: Sciatic Pain

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 5:35 pm
by Dan Monahan
Thanks for your reply Michael.

He never mentioned he was an MBF practioner, just says he has studied it. Knowing Matt is he a good practioner then? Is there much difference from Egoscue to MBF?? From what I have read things seem very similar and the founder of MBF worked as an Egoscue Practioner am I right? The principals seem very similar, as in joints stacked on top of each other, re-alignment, muscle imbalances etc.

I have a bulging disc, not a rupture, but it is quiet a large bulge though, I have my MRI pictures that i could send you, but I can't attach them on here.

Just hope Matt can help me, as I don't know of any MBF practioners in my area of near by, do you know of any in the south of England near London?

Thanks again for your reply Michael, really appreciate it :)

Re: Sciatic Pain

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 6:53 pm
by Michael Jen
The idea of posture, the joints stacked on top of each other, muscle imbalances, etc... is nothing that is unique to MBF, Egoscue, or any other method of therapy. Those aspects of the body have been around for a very long time and can be found in many different systems of therapy. What makes each system unique is the way they go about to achieve their goal.

Though there are some similar exercises, the way that Egoscue goes about to achieve their goal is very different from MBF. To the untrained eye, Egoscue and MBF seem similar, just as to the non-martial artist, karate seems the same as kung fu and judo seems same as jiu-jitsu. As martial artists we know there are huge differences between the various arts, there is a similar difference between MBF and Egoscue and the two don't mix.

I believe there are 2 people who do MBF near London. I can can drop you an e-mail later with their contact info.

I only know of Matt through a client who worked with him. The guy is also from the UK and has seen your post. He said he'll make a post later and share this experience.

Re: Sciatic Pain

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 7:07 pm
by Dan Monahan
Thanks Michael, that would be great if you could send me the information.

Totally understand what you mean about how the untrained eye would not see much diffence between different Martial Art disciplines.

I did notice that a Veena Kudhail has posted and on the MBF website the contact details are on there as an MBF Practioner, and he/se is based in Chigwell, which is very near to me I live in Dagenham Essex, much nearer than Surrey where Matt is based.

Many thanks
Dan :)

Re: Sciatic Pain

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 8:08 pm
by Michael Jen
Yes, you can check out Veena.

By the way, had a bulging disc in the past and I recovered from it 100%, so there's definitely hope for you.

Re: Sciatic Pain

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 9:02 pm
by neil
My name is Neil and I am currently working with an mbf practitioner in Oxford.

I can only share with you my experiences regarding this therapy and in no way want to make personal observations.
In my experience

1. MBF is more structured than egoscue, my menus now are carefully sequenced and progressive.When i began egoscue therapy i had a lot of advanced exercises that where doing me more harm than good.
2. I have worked with Matt, he tried to mix MBF and egoscue in one of my programs and it really messed me up. He probably meant well but for me it was a disaster. I know that Matt has taken the first 2 levels but i would work with a therapist who has taken all 3 levels of MBF
. Veena sounds like a good bet. ( I currently travel 6 hour round trip to see MBF rather than an egoscue therapist who is 30 mins away)
3. I am making real progress with my menus (now on 2nd menu)
I am in a bit of a mess, my body feels about 90 years old but I can see my functions beginning to return
I accept this will be a slow process but i just have to get on with it.
Currently i do my menu 2/3 times per day and try walking about a mile.
I know it may hurt you to move but if your in pain sometimes the worst thing you can do ius stop moving altogether.
What is not sometimes talked about is what being in chronic pain does to you mentally, it can really put fear into you, but i am so relieved to have found a method that makes sense and treats the underlying cause of problems, not symptoms. Its a struggle some days and i get real down but i just have to get on with it.
All you have to do is read Michael's story on his home page to show what can be done, i find it a rteal inspiration.

I know deep down i will get there 1 day, its my ambition to be able to run again and play the violin

So good luck, stick with MBF and enjoy the process, take the good days and the bad


Re: Sciatic Pain

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:45 pm
by Dan Monahan
Hi Neil

Thank you very much for your reply, really appreciate it mate :D

I have emailed Veena this evening and has replied back saying will look at my pictures tomorrow and will get back to me, I found out where Veena is based and it's only a 15min drive from my house which is perfect :D

Sounds like you have been through alot Neil, doesn't sound too good about the combining of Egoscue and MBF though?! Recipe for disaster it sounds!

I have tried many exercises from the Egoscue book that are meant to be basic but I can't even start the exercise, the main one was the counter stretch, I have no curve in my lower back and my hamstrings are seriously tight, and I can't even get anywhere near the decided position! So I understand what you mean by some Egoscue exercises are difficult and too advanced.

Thats alot of dedication to do your exercises 2.3 times a day, do you work at the moment Neil? I work 9-5pm, but I am willing to do the exercises before work and after work, I will do whatever it takes to get rid of my pain...

It's bad enough that I cannot do my Karate and Freestyle martial art Fue Loon Freestyle, but I just want to be able to lay on my back in bed, walk to the shops, walk to work, go out with my friends for a night out, without having to drink alcohol to control my pain with painkillers, I want to be a 23 year old again :( if I can get that mobility back I will be so happy :D

As you said not much is mentioned about the mental side of chronic pain, there is a book that I want to read by Dr. Sarno, called "Healing Back Pain" and it is not about how pain is in out head but sometimes we put mental blocks in our head that can make our pain worse like "I don't want to walk because it will hurt" "If I drive that far it will hurt" this will set us up to experience pain, and I know I do it myself sometimes, and sometimes we will be out and the girlfriend may ask me, "How is your hip?" and I will maybe be okay not too bad, as soon as that is said I will experience pain!! :?: The mind body connection is very strong, and we have to control the mind as well as the muscles!!

I have read Michael's story and it is very influential especially coming from a Martial Arts backgroud myself!

Neil thank you again for you reply, and I will post on how I get on if I decide to go with Matt or Veena.

Many thanks to all
Dan :)

Re: Sciatic Pain

PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:47 pm
by Dan Monahan
Oh yeah forgot to ask you Neil, how long have you been working with your MBF Practioner?

Dan :)

Re: Sciatic Pain

PostPosted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 11:40 am
by neil
Hi Dan

I have been working with my person for 7 weeks now, i think somewhere there is a schedule about updates, i just could not get down to oxford to see him so hence i am only on my second program

I find that the biggest culprit for my pain was and is sitting down to much
I have an excessive tilt in my pelvis which puts a lot of stress on the knees and hips, and my shoulders slump forward as does my head

I have probably had this posture for 5/6 years and in the early days was just chasing individual symptoms (why is my low back hurting?why is my knee now hurting)
I went from running 20 miles a week to a job that involved a lot of driving,
sitting down 3 hours per day in the car and thencoming home and 'resting'
So i find some of my exercises now target the leg muscles so called gait muscles, which atrophy when you sit too much.
I find the more challenging you find an exercise its a good sign of your level of dysfunction, imbalance call it what you will.

Yeah, being in pain is totally crappy, as i said before i feel like an old man!
Please keep in touch on the forum and let me know how your exercises are going, when you have pain/problems its always comforting to hear similiar stories.


Re: Sciatic Pain

PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 11:10 am
by Dan Monahan
I'm seeing Veena on Monday for my initial assessment.

I'll keep you all posted, and let you know how I am getting on along my way, and what dysfunctions are found (There will be

Many thanks to both Michael & Neil.

Take care and all the best.
Dan :D